I had read
your posts as basically giving a lock on the modern Quatrefoil to Girard as your main point of attribution. Otherwise you might have asked "who designed this take on that pattern?". My pointing out That Girard was not the fist to use it was to help dismiss the idea that the pattern necessarily made its way over to Howard Miller from Herman Miller. That, and me having seen the pattern positively attributed to Umanoff. Also, I can not see the detail on your pic well, but if it is the same as the clock I am looking at right now, it is a very different version. I am seeing the Umanoff pattern composed of 5 circles (one in the center), while the Girard is 4 joined teardrop shapes (sorry, best description I can muster). If you are headed in that direction, please do not take offense. This is not an attack. I have certainly spent my share of time in the glass house of misattribution. Sometime I just might tell you about the scolding I got from Risom's daughter on the attribution subject. These were comments to try to help answer your query, and certainly not to pick on you or Girard..
So who was the first to turn...
So who was the first to turn the quatrefoil shape into a pattern? I have to admit I have never seen the quatrefoil as a fabric pattern before Girard. Prior to Girard I have only seen the quatrefoil in three dimensional form, architectural or sculptural, more elaborate in shape and much larger in size. The Girard quatrefoil is also different from most in that it is turned on it's axis into more of an X shape. And I don't recall seeing the quatrefoil used as a tiny repeating pattern before Girard. So I'd be curious to see what you are referring to, because I have always thought of the Girard design as totally original and distinct, even though the quatrefoil shape goes back to the Gothic era.
In any case, I disagree with your statement that the pattern on the clocks and mirrors is "very different" from what Girard designed. I am not trying to attack you either and I guess we can just agree to disagree. I just think it is really obvious that the pattern is based on the Girard. To me, the similarities are far more obvious than the dissimilarities, and I would attribute those small differences to the fact the design was being translated from a woven fabric into one that had to be milled into wood. I am sure that circles are much easier to mill into wood than teardrop shapes. Add to that the association of Howard Miller with George Nelson and Herman Miller--the link to Girard just seems pretty obvious to me.
That said, if you can point me to some examples of the quatrefoil shape used as a modern pattern from this time period I will have to concede that you're right, I just haven't seen any examples before.
yes we can
agree to disagree, but you are disagreeing with things I have not said. So, I really have no place to respond other than repeating the idea I used to refute your attribution assumptions that seems to have offended you. That is that knowing Girard did not invent the quatrefoil, and the mirror was a production by a different company, would have been enough for me to refrain from making the connection that you did. I made no disparaging comments about Girard, or his work, nor would I. I feel you are defending Girard's honor and challenging me on slights I did not make.
Glassartist - not offended,...
Glassartist - why do you say I"m offended? I'm not at all. I'm just asking you to back up your assertion that the modernist quatrefoil pattern was not pioneered by Girard. I'd like to see some examples of other modern quatrefoil patterns from this time period. If you can back up your point, then I'll agree with your conclusion that the Meridian quatrefoil has nothing to do with the Girard quatrefoil. If you can't show my any examples, then I will continue to disagree with you. I am perfectly willing to accept that I might have been wrong but I think it's fair to ask you to show me the proof.
No really,
"I'm just asking you to back up your assertion that the modernist quatrefoil pattern was not pioneered by Girard"
I never made that assertion anywhere.
Please reread my posts. I said Girard did not invent the quatrefoil. A true statement. I made no statement about Girard and his interpretation of a very old design, just that he did not invent it. You are still defending against something I did not say. Just to be perfectly clear, I think his redo of that old pattern was nothing short of brilliant. I did not and would not say what you think I did.
I think this is a Cado 161...
Saw this and went there right away and was in beautiful condition. Has another bookcase wall unit with it and the seller had a nice danish chair to go with it. Might not keep the chair, but was thinking based on the look of the cabinet and the drop down this might be a Cado 161?
That looks like a Cado to...
That looks like a Cado to me. I've always been quite partial to those lovely basket weave cabinet fronts....I've been looking for that elusive table attachment for my Cado for ages....lucky you.... they don't come up too often, at least not where I'm from.
Enjoy it!
If it were mine, I'd be lovingly smearing it down with lotions and emollients as we speak...:-)
Glassartist--Obviously Girard...
Glassartist--Obviously Girard didn't invent the quatrefoil! But I never said he did. I just said his design was original, which you seemed to deny, but couldn't back up so now you're just backpedaling. I'm not going to clog up this thread with any more nonsense.
I denied
I denied no such thing. Anywhere. I have removed none of my posts. I have reread them all numerous times. There is none of your claims about any kind of slight to Girard anywhere. You say "seem to deny" indicating something you read into it. Not anything I said. It is all there still. Cite or retract. Please do not put words into my mouth. BTW, Love the mirror/shelf. A rare bird and beautiful too.
@jdip
Your chairs are Eames designed DCW's manufactured by Evans. The single shockmount is correct for this early version chair. Not sure about the finish.
norm
I am still up in the air about it. I feel they are old chairs and I am not aware of "old" copies although others are way more familiar with this stuff than I am. I believe that some one put some type of clear coat on the face of the backrest and seat at one time during their life. If they are truly Eames chairs I don't know why top edge of the shock mount is not flush with the top edge of the neck like I see on all other examples across the Internet.
I asked Woody what makes them fakes just so I could learn a bit so as to avoid making the mistake again but never got an answer. Woody, if you could enlighten me I would really appreciate it.
Trollpirate
strikes again! I changed no content. I always edit for grammar and clarity directly after I post and before they are even read by others. Man, you are a predictable one trick pony on this forum. My edit for this post; coming from you, a request to grow up is seriously ironic. Yeesh.
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