It is what you can not see.
What he has done is taken a new external frame and married it with an old back plate and electronics.
It is fake.
It also appears Modernesia is operating at a wholesale operation of fakes - having them entered into auctions around the country and is operating literally dozens of Ebay user I.D.s and has items being placed into peoples hands all over the place.
His fakes are very, very good.
Expect in 10 years to find literally hundreds of people wanting his blood - and the many others who work for him - when they take their junk to Rago or some other auction house.
No one believes an outright lie - but mix a little truth and you can blind an owl with bulls__t. He likes to marry old pieces with new pieces so you think "how could it be fake if it has..."
I suspect we are seeing him operate at the level of a workshop with several people doing nothing but faking items and pumping them out.
I would also be weary of purchasing anything from "simplymod-auctions" and also "dejavulb" on ebay. they either work for him or get their items directly from him I suspect.
If it is 60 years old and there isn't a smudge on it - there is a very good reason why. Check out the labels and you might start to understand the scope of the problem.
I can not tell you how good it is to have many totally verified pieces with Knoll Labels etc. at every stage of production in their history.
Having an original old Nelson clock helps, too - while you can fake the outside, and even use old mechanisms with new outer rim shells, you can not fake that the new out rims and wood spikes are different - only on the inside of the clock - visually from the outside, they are bang-on.
Fakes are excellent these days, but they are not perfect when you have them side-by-side to originals.
And I have to say, ebay loves this guy. I shudder to think the money he is pulling in from his operations around the US.
Provenance would be ideal to get when buying really nice items, and legit sellers seem to not have a problem providing it when asked. Try asking the two ebay user IDs for specifics on provenance...suddenly, you will notice your not getting replies - or answers that can be verified.
I get disgusted by it - and I am letting off steam because real sellers that sell REAL items that have vintage damage and age can't sell their items, and these fakes are getting top prices.
It is backwards.
The Con Men have stepped up and are giving verification a hard time.
A.S.
I think you need to look at that clock again.
There is nothing new about that clock, you can see that there is considerable wear in the pictures, granted the pictures make it look like a new front piece but a closer inspection shows that it is pretty beat up which would be right for the age.
Also I would like to know how you drew your conclusions on the above posted sellers. How are they also connected to modernnesia? They don't have similar auction posting styles, they don't even use similar language. Is everyone from the La area connected to modernesia? I don't fully understand your post.
I can say without a doubt that I have seen many of the items in their auctions sold at long beach and rose bowl flea markets. My guess as why they don't reply to provenance questions is because they were purchased in said markets from sellers who may have gotten them from anywhere.
l1flafly,If you read above...
l1flafly,
If you read above in the thread, someone pointed out that 'industrialarts' aka 'malihini' was linked to modernesia and is either the same person or a friend of his. I believe someone mentioned that 'industrialarts' buys pieces on ebay that modernesia then alters and resells. Just based on this, I think you'd have to call into question anything this seller is offering on ebay.
l1flafly read up before you...
l1flafly read up before you jump on their band wagon. also if anyone ever questioned me about where i got my items I would tell them. "oh i bought them from a vendor at a flea market, or I bought them from a dead mans estate"...the lack of answers is only more of a reason to be suspicious in this business.
Also are you serious that you find that these dealers have nothing but mint, perfect condition, perfectly labeled items....They have sold 100+ chairs in perfect condition and I dont know how familiar you are with vintage furniture but I have never found a piece that was in perfect condition even when i freshly picked it from a estate sale of a 80 year old man. I know that sounds harsh but I go where the furniture is and im sure 90% of the people on here do to. Over time items get messed up from kids and general wear and tear...you are talking about over 50 years of use.
either they have the worlds largest supply of furniture which came from a lady who didnt enjoy sitting on chairs and never had pets or children or they simply produce fakes and work together to do so.
My personal feeling is that it is "all in the family" I believe there is probably a dealer who is producing these fakes and is working with a brother / brother in law etc in order to keep it tight and secretive.
also if one ebay dealer was buying chairs and selling the same chair which had been restored it would be so easy to figure out that they would have to be mentally challenged and judging by their profits i dont think they are. They buy under some accts and sell under others in order to minimize their potential of getting caught.
Only responding to the...
Only responding to the simplymod auctions portion of tinyarmada's last post - their danish teak items look very solid to me from what I've seen over the last 12 months. Most of those pieces aren't rare collector's items, but high quality everyday furniture (many unsigned) that probably were bought at estate sales in Denmark. Any custom cabinetry work to repair one of these pieces correctly would probably cost more than the piece itself.
That is one of the reasons why I like mid-century Danish teak and rosewood pieces: it is almost more of a hassle to create a good fake than simply buying the original in the first place.
Agree cdsilva
tinyarmada's post is just slightly "off the rocker" (pun intended). I highly doubt that simplymod-auctions is related to modernesia in any way. From what I have observed, simplymod carries (imports) mostly generic Danish stuff with the occasional nice designer piece. Because Danish design is less common in the U.S. overall, that partially explains the excessive prices (in my opinion) that the generic items typically go for. Also, the seller has clearly built up quite a following over the years.
Industrial arts ripped me off too. But I sort of deserved it.
Well I would like to introduce myself as the noob who bought two lemon Zeniths and the Black LCM and one of the recent LCWs.
I am out over 4000.00
Needless to say, I contacted Fred to discuss my desire for sending the chairs back.
I am a newbie of course in the collecting of Eames ( my expertise lies elsewhere sadly)
But as soon as I received the chairs I had a few misgivings in my short time of study.
1. The zenith labels looked too perfect and recently printed. But I could be paranoid due to the other things off on the other chairs.
2. The shells looked waay to new to be a 1950 production. Even if you put this in a closet for 50 years it would have some age to it.But again, this is very difficult to determine. They might be legit shells with bleaching to clean them.
3. The finish on the LCW is a bit on the shiny side...satiny is a better word. But the foil sticker is already coming off... I think this is a copy label.
4. The Eiffel base on the first shell I got was much too perfect..looked newly powder coated and had no wear or rust...I am a product designer by trade,, and I am sorry, but half century old metal will have some wear... this had none..
5 Also very key, the base did not fit the shell. The front flanges where too angled to fit properly. This led me to think it was a new base or a marriage that was newly finished.
6.The glides had no wear other than a minor amount of fresh scratching on the bottom .
There are many more things but i won't bore you with details.
Needless to say I am very heartbroken. I feel the LCW is real, but later and refinished and an older lable placed on it.
The Black ash LCM is in my mind a mis match of an old Evans frame with other parts married. What confused me was the finish on the black was so shiny and perfect yet the Evans frame had domes of silence that were pretty messed up. I actually travelled to California on vacation to find replacements and lovingly restored it with the proper ones... but ironically did not realize the chair was not right to begin with...the wood had to be refinished and or the parts are off newer examples. You all would know better than me.
But this has been a learning experience..I just don;t want it to sour me to the world of collecting these wonderful designs. I am no expert, and most my time has been spent in the study of turn of the century/Arts and craft, so mid century is new for me... pretty embarrassed to be honest.
Anyway long rant, but pretty depressing night. Not sure what to think.
I am getting...
two of the three chairs looked at today by a reputable local dealer, and if she can't be sure, she has the Eames expert to come in to check it out.
I have already explained to Fred, that if I find out anything has been modifed, these are going back.
He has been very charming in his responses so far because I have kept a calm head, but this is pretty upsetting. I already contacted ebay and explained the situation and they said if I can get documentation from the expert these are not what he claimed them to be I have a good case for refund.
I don't think I will need to take it that far as he already said he was willing to take them back if I am not happy with them.
We will see later today.
can you explain
industrialarts
The black "LCM" currently listed is such a joke. So funny I forgot to laugh.
posted by woodywood (USA)
What is wrong with it? Is it the condition of the wood, or the fact there are wrong parts with the Evans frame? It is sitting in my livingroom as we speak.
Feeling like a fool right about now. ;-/
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