william-holden-caulfield was being funny trying to show ugly something can be by posting a piece of Tomorrow's Classic with what he refered to a "ditsy" pattern. He did this in the "Are these Nelson pieces rip-offs" thread.
I explained why those beautiful Zeisel pieces came in all-white and were issued with patterns.
He replied that it just goes to show how stupid were (back then).
This is where some of you people are way out of line and indeed, stupid, too.
Here we sit in 2009 making judgements not about the quality of a design from 1947, but the intelligence of the people making the stuff and those buying it too.
Here's the bottom line, boys and girls, attack the quality of the damn designs but calling the people stupid is the kind of thing that I would like to see Patrick and Alix ban people from this forum over.
william-holden-caulfield, I don't give a rat's ass is you like the gravy bowl or not, but calling people who would buy it stupid is wrong, no matter how you look at it.
I patiently explained that it was Hall that required Zeisel to come up with pattern designs, since patterned china was popular with the post-war public that Hall was marketing to. That was the way it was, and rather than acting like you by calling the potential buyers "stupid", Zeisel went with the flow and had her students come up with designs. There were over 10 designs, and probably more.
cont.
Part 2
Now, I prefer the solid all-white, but I'm looking at it 62 years after the fact. However, even though some of the designs are downright ugly to me, the people designing them and the people who bought them are certainly not stupid.
Calling these people stupid, whether or not you're joking is what I object to. Look who's calling the kettle stupid!
Look through my postings; have I attacked anyone here or those people back then? Nope. Have I said I don't like splayed leg chairs? Yes. Have I suggested that those people who designed the splayed leg chairs should be lined up against a wall and shot? Nope.
It's the degree that a few select people take it upon themselves and make comments about the intelligence of people back then that I object to.
Go ahead and do it, if you think you're being clever. And people like me will there to point out how out-of-line you are.
Oy.
I think you're being more than a little thin-skinned, Barry.
A) I called no particular person "stupid", but rather the theoretical group of "collectors" who prefer Zeisels's forms covered in fussy, ditsy floral patterns. I was genuinely surprised to hear that these patterns, on THESE forms, are highly prized. To embrace these traditional patterns, which only serve to detract from the gorgeous forms, strikes me as a kind of stupidity, yes.
B) I'm not surprised that Eva Zeisel "went with the flow"-- doesn't everybody bite their tongue when faced with a dumb request from a boss or customer? Neither you or I know what she muttered under her breath.
C) I'm a "she" not a "he".
D) To always assume you're being "attacked" (and, it's become a reoccurring theme, with you) is to assume you're the center of the universe.
Barry, you attach a too...
Barry, you attach a too great importance to a quite harmless comment!
Please stop creating tensions in discussions when there is no reason to do so. There is no personal attack in william-holden-caulfield's comment.
To say that a majority of people is not as clever as one could expect is not revolutionary nor critiquable. If you prefer, in this case one should rather say that people have bad taste.
The patterns that one added on dinnerware pieces at that time were rarely wanted and designed by the designers themself.
It was a pragmatic addition intended to reach customers who were not ready to accept the modernity of designer's creations of that time.
Personally, I find that these patterns are like a verruca on the face of a pretty girl.
Thanks but I do not agree
with a couple of poster's use of words like "stupid", "idiots" and similar phrases. I'm not hyper-politically correct, either.
It's just some responses push a button or two and I'd like to think that it's within my right to point that out.
If I were to adhere to your point of view, then nothing anyone could say should affect me or the other readers of this forum.
Let's agree to disagree, then.
By the way, two of the patterns, Fantasy and Dawn, fetch higher prices these days than the all-white.
I do NOT take it as a personal attack on me...it's just some of the postings seem unduly sleazy and I think it's possible to voice an opinion without some of that.
Splayed leg chairs; I don't like them and think they're ugly, but the people who designed them and the people who bought them are not stupid, idiots, retards, or any such-thing.
I can say something is ugly to me without attacking anyone. Now...what about this don't you understand?
"I can say something is ugly...
"I can say something is ugly to me without attacking anyone. Now...what about this don't you understand?"
I, for one, don't understand your intense sensitivity. If no one else is belly aching it must be you. No offense, but take it easy. In your circle of friends, I bet you feel like you can say anything ... maybe even the occasional vulgarity. It's because they know you and you know them, and some of us have been here long enough to share that sentiment. I rag my friends all the time without their feathers getting ruffled. Just think of us as your friends. That's all for now.
dinnerware fans are numerous...
dinnerware fans are numerous and don't necessarily give a damn about modernism: their interest is partly about design, but partly collector obsessiveness....
imo, of course. imo. "obsessive" not necessarily a bad thing. some of my best friends, etc.....
I saw the C&B Century's and they look nice
(even though the Century collection at C&B is a weird hybrid mixture of Tomorrow's Classic & Century, two different and unreleased lines Zeisel designed for Hall.
But even more beautiful is the One-0-One line sold exclusively at Bloomingdale's.
Wow, they're beautiful, expensive, and even dishwasher safe.
I was thinking, though, of just buying the Century teapot from C&B, but is seems never to go on sale.
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