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Eames ESU - Where's the best price?  

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LuciferSum
(@lucifersum)
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Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 1874
28/09/2007 4:15 am  

Cost
I cant afford the ESU I want (the 4x2 with doors and in color), but I dont think the price is unreasonable when you look at comparable pieces.
ESU 4x2: 58"hx47"w : $2725
Room&Board Linear Series : 56"h x 74"w : $2100
Crate & Barrel Calistoga Buffet & Hutch: 57"w x 70"h : $2698
Ethan Allen Marquetry Video Cabinet (totally awful!) : 70"w x 36"h : $3750


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
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Posts: 2649
28/09/2007 4:34 am  

Modern Woodworks
Modern Woodworks would be less than 2/3's of those prices.


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finch
(@finch)
Noble Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 227
28/09/2007 5:32 am  

I can take a photograph of...
I can take a photograph of my ESU if you'd like. There's nothing clunky about it. I was surprised at the revilement above. The customer designed pieces...the TV center above for example -- that's just a kludge of ideas using some of the hallmark components of the ESU series. Not very harmonious, but not representative of all Modern Woodworks work.
As an aside, all TVs look like hell to me, no matter how sleek or unassuming. It's a big appliance. I keep mine in a closet and roll it out as needed. Hi-Fi Equipment, on the other hand...


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finch
(@finch)
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Posts: 227
28/09/2007 5:37 am  

esu prices
It's not that the ESU doesn't look better and embody the less-is-more aesthetic better than the other cabinets you listed, it's just that the components are so basic and the construction so simple, that I feel the price should reflect that a bit more.


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LRF
 LRF
(@lrf)
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Posts: 2967
28/09/2007 7:29 am  

very radical thinking on yo...
very radical thinking on your part lucifersum!!! great that you are a orthodox pureist, but the rest of the world could care less about the Eames. We do cause we are design addicts less than .000000000000001 percent of the world or a very small group,
The Eames were nice people who were ahead of their time and came up with some great stuff in a mid century post world war 2 world,
If you want to be 100 percent pure , put your money were your mouth is , get to it and start looking for 50s vintage Eames ESU at all the auction houses, get the check book out and be prepared to pay big bucks for your rusted out ESU Shelf with lots of rust on it,
Nobody and I repeat Nobody loves the originals and respects the designs and owns the originals more than i do,
after 30 years i have built up a great original collection, but i am not stupid.
In a minute if I needed to put my flat panel on a ESU I would not put it on any thing other than a solid shelf that can accomodate this expensive piece of equipment ,and if i wanted the ESU look I would get it, So Lucifer lets just take all the fakes,Moderica,Modern wood, etc out of the picture cause they are not going to work for you,
and Herman Millers will not work cause the 42 inch plasma just won't cut it with out the modification,
Once again the Eames were great people but for g-d sake let them rest in peace they made their mark on this world, in a world that had not that much to offer at that time.
I think you are the only one who thinks they would be mad if they saw modifications of their designs, I think they would approve that anyone would be thinking out of the box with a little help from them,


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LRF
 LRF
(@lrf)
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Posts: 2967
28/09/2007 7:34 am  

finch and barrympls
You guys both make good sense on the ESU , you both know what it is all about!!! a piece of furniture to house your stuff nothing more , not a prayer alter


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
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28/09/2007 7:54 am  

Thanx LRF
You guys both make good sense on the ESU , you both know what it is all about!!! a piece of furniture to house your stuff nothing more , not a prayer alter.
- - - - - - - - - - -
Nice of you to say that.
I DO like original and I'm extremely picky about a lot of things, but bookshelves and desks MUST fit with in my current lifestyle, or they're worth taking up space.
Luckily, the Nelson CSS stuff is so versatile that anyone can make it do whatever you want it to do. (My standard 95" pole shelf houses my CD collection and my stereo system. My shorter shelf system is going up - finally- next week, because this one's going to house some heavier shelfs and will have to installed into the wall using the stablizers. It going to house my 'art' and ceramics.
I was very frustrated at not being able to find a Herman Miller or Knoll desk for my computer - complete with CPU, monitor and pull-out drawer for the keyboard.
I settled on the Blu Dot Paperclip desk. It's OK but it's one of those "well designed items made in China using their mass produced style of manufacture and the world's lousiest instructions"!
but I have a Bill Stumpf grey and bourgandy lamp for Herman Miller sitting on top of the desk.


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
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28/09/2007 7:55 am  

I meant
...or they're NOT worth taking up space! (God, wish I could edit what I wrote)


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LRF
 LRF
(@lrf)
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28/09/2007 7:59 am  

we got the message barrympls...
we got the message barrympls we fiqured out


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LRF
 LRF
(@lrf)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 2967
28/09/2007 8:13 am  

the greatest find I found...
the greatest find I found was the Cado units they can house every thing from stereo to books. magazines,
for some reason Desk are the hardest thing to find and buy from the mid century ,
I bought the George Nelson roll
top on the wall but I use it in the studio .makes me feel like a famous architect,
My big desk is a 1980 Baker Desk, sorry to say not designed by any one famous but made by Baker furniture and not Modern. hard to believe but when i bought it in 1980 I was still buying the traditional furniture, i have used this desk for almost 30 years, great desk made a lot of money sitting behind it and lost a little money sitting behind it, but it has been a part of my life for half of it.... and still looks good,


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LuciferSum
(@lucifersum)
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Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 1874
28/09/2007 9:28 am  

Nothing Radical At All
Absolutely nothing is radical in my post. People claim the knock-offs are just as good as the licensed versions and I pointed out where they differ.
You can argue how big your collection is LRF, but you clearly dont respect the original designs if you are willing to bastardize their legitimacy by promoting knocked off crap. I don't worship the Eames nor do I put the furniture I own up on a pedestal - I use it. But I do respect their designs enough that if I want one in my house I'll chose something that is authentic - be it original or a licensed production.
And if you think I'd be the only one angry about the Eames designs being knocked off, why don't you take a look at what the Eames themselves had to say:


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finch
(@finch)
Noble Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 227
28/09/2007 12:01 pm  

two more cents
I'm not about to become embroiled in this argument, but I think crap and bastardized are hyperbolic and over generalizing to say the least. As far as details not gotten right, I really do beg to differ. I have seen and studied original ESUs, (at unobtanium prices -- think posterity/reference pieces), and the Modern Woodworks (at least the basic model 400 I purchased, after much research) really is up to the job. Read, identical, excepting the aged patina. I'm not just defending my purchase. The Modern Woodworks is clearly made by someone who loves the ESUs, and what is more, I think the construction and the price honestly do better reflect the Eamses sensibility of good looking, functional, affordable furniture, especially where this piece is concerned.


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finch
(@finch)
Noble Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 227
28/09/2007 12:13 pm  

Also, the license issue --...
Also, the license issue -- I'm behind that. But there is nuance to this matter, too. I think that, as a consumer, you have to listen to more than just what the manufacturer sells in an ad campaign. Example, the Modernica or the Modern Woodworks versions are built here in the States, use the same raw materials, and are just as handsomely constructed, and in the instance of the MW, it is half the price. I think the onus is on Herman Miller to show a buyer what the quantifiable differences in quality between the two pieces are for that kind of bread -- other than the foil sticker.
You have to be skeptical about this stuff, otherwise you become religious about it.


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 2649
28/09/2007 6:05 pm  

There IS a dfference
There IS a difference between finely crafted ESU units from Modern Woodworks and the low-quality Chinese-made assembly-line knockoffs Nelson benches being sold on eBay and from Furniture Fancy, etc.
Since the Eames Foundation people haven't actively 'gone after' Modern Woodworks, and apparently he's a craftsman down in Louisiana trying to make a living, I don't think anyone who buys from him would have to feel the need to turn themselves over to the Federal authorities.....
But....in my suggested list of terms (Original, Reproduction, Knockoffs, etc.) I don't think it's possible to differentiate a high quality illegal knockoff from the crap coming out of China....even though there certainly is.


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LuciferSum
(@lucifersum)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 15 years ago
Posts: 1874
28/09/2007 7:10 pm  

example
Last year at Harvard University a student was discovered to have plagiarized parts of her novel from at least 6 other novels. When this had been discovered did the publisher say "oh, its okay - the rest of her writing is just as good as those parts she stole from other people"? Did they say "we'll continue to sell this book because the other authors have had a chance to make their own money, and I'm sure they'd be flattered by her copying" ? NO. The publisher pulled her books from the shelves, cancelled the contract for another 2 books, and forced her to return her six figure signing bonus.
Why did they do this? Because as a company they recognize that one person using another persons idea for profit is wrong. If the guy from ModernWoodworks is such an honest, hardworking guy why doesnt he sell his own designs? Because he can profit off of the work already done by the Eames.
And my upbringing in a creative family, my life and first career in the art field, and my current design work have taught me that this is just plain wrong.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/28/books/28author.html?ex=1303876800&en=5...


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