The "Best Bargain or Find" is by and large my favorite thread on Design Addict. There is nothing quite like that moment of joy when you find THE object. But I wonder...do we have an obligation when we find something REALLY valuable? At what point does it become exploitation rather than a good find?
For some there is a very clear line. In the original thread 420 clearly stole a chair from McDonalds. She rationalized it by citing her obesity and cholesterol problems as a result of eating too much of their food. A weak argument - as her lack of control can be pointed to in both instances.
In another instance - the Eames RAR at Goodwill, or the 670's at Goodwill. It can be plausibly argued that a) there isnt a heirarchy built into Goodwill to explain that the chair is valuable and b) Goodwill does not garner the type of collector who would pay full price for such an item. One would hope that a generous donation would be made to Goodwill at some point - good karma for a good find. Indeed, the gentleman who found the 670's left a big tip to the very confused staffer.
Now, without passing any judgment -a scenario that falls in an ambiguous place between such baseline examples - the Panton rugs. Here we have a situation where someone has discovered something quite valuable. The person selling it is in a position to make significantly more money on the sale with just a little bit of information. Is there an obligation to inform the person despite what we might gain?
In the instance where we gain something that we might not otherwise be able to obtain - I would say no. If I came on a 670 being sold for 20$ I would buy it. I will most likely not ever be able to afford one otherwise. But I feel like its different when the item will be resold at a much greater profit. Does that mean, had I found those rugs, I would have said something? I confess its hard to say.
I certainly think it depends somewhat on the source. An anonymous booth at an antique store is different than a little old lady selling things on her stoop. And that is different than the RICH little old lady who's downsizing her belongings so she can move to the Riviera to spend the rest of her days. Lol. Maybe I'm just rambling on at this point. Anyone else want to jump in?
Today, at my
local public library (a large city main branch) I bought, at the charity bookstall, a 1971 Sunset paperback "Furniture You Can Make" (original cover price $1.95). The young man looked inside (as I had) and informed me the price would be $1. I said to him "I think it is worth. . .TWO dollars," and handed him that amount. He was slightly taken aback, then said something about the books being priced low, and that "it's for a good cause." I told him that was my thought, too, and put the book in my bag.
This book might bring $20 or more on eBay; I don't intend to sell it, and am not sure just what use I will get from it. My modest voluntary charity makes me feel a LITTLE better about not doing more for this worthy institution. . .
SDR
I buy and sell
I buy and sell and my feeling is that if someone offers an item with a set price, that's what I pay. I do not offer more than that. It's very easy these days to research an item and to find the going rate for it. If people don't take the time to do that, that's their problem.
However---if anyone asks me what an item is worth, I give them an honest answer! That is a totally different situation and it actually comes up a lot, though not so much with mod stuff because most of the people I know don't deal in that at all. The ones who do know at least as much as I do, if not more.
I've gotten a couple of excellent deals at Goodwill that I ended up selling for a big profit but I've more than covered that with donations to them over the years, so no guilt there.
I buy stuff at auction all the time at prices way below market value. I guess I could feel guilty that the consignor didn't get much for a great item, but that's a risk you take when you consign to an auction house. The auctioneer doesn't always know what he has, either, which is a shame for the consignor but it happens a lot.
Depends...
If you are buying something for yourself, a good deal is a good deal. Figure the person who sold you the item will have their good deals too. Now as far as a bloodsucking dealers who only wants a profit and has let themselves get to the point of human dishonesty, their actions are the way their life is. Here in Santa Cruz, CA, most of our dealers(flea market and antique) are really sleazy and I get annoyed seeing them at thrift shops.
Hi LuciferSUM.
Sorry but...
Hi LuciferSUM.
Sorry but I'm gonna tell the old folks that "$25? - sorry but they're worth at least $2500 so that's what I'll pay you. How about I'll swing by the bank and come back later with a big fat cheque?". It doesn't work that way. And if the price is $25, I'm not gonna say "nah, I'll give you a $100, alright?" They would think I'm nuts.
I once also bought two Wire Cones chairs from an old lady for $200 and sold them on for around $1500. I'm sure she could have used the money to sweeten up her life a little but as a student, so could I.
I have no remorse and no regrets concerning this subject. The money from the carpet will help me spending less time working the next months so I can concentrate on my furniture design. Besides, I use every chance I get to write people, stores, eBay and local auction houses whenever they have listed items under the wrong name, misspelled the designer/company, provided wrong info etc.
knowledge
knowledge is power.
and knowledge brings riches.
in this business we spend countless hours researching items and this is how we get piad... by knowing more than the average shmuck.
if a seller is happy with the price or gives you a price we are not obligated legally or ethically to tell the seller the actual value of the piece. if we did, there would be no dealers or commerce in a resale market whatsoever.
honesty and dishonesty
Is it dishonest to buy something for a low price when you know it's worth much more? I don't think so. As I said before, it's not hard to find out the value of things these days. If you shop on ebay, you know there are all kinds of people who don't know much about modern design but know enough to find out what they have.
What's dishonest is to lie to someone who asks what an item is worth. I'm often asked to look at antique and colletible dolls because the owner wants an idea of what they're worth. I buy and sell antique dolls and could easily give lowball figures and then offer to buy them, as many dealers do. In fact, I know of one major auction house that does this on their Appraisal Days. But this would be very dishonest and it would keep me from sleeping well at night, and I avoid anything that threatens my sleep! So I don't do it.
Karma !
I would say that honesty is your best option.
I am one of those dealers that believe the benefit should be to all.
If you ask me for the value of a piece I will tell you the best figure based on current condition.
I will then offer you 75% of this and sell it at 100% of the value as I am not a charity and need to make a living.
I helped a gentleman like that who was offered £250 for 2 1967 original and quistgaard chairs.
Once sold I sent him a cheque for way over £2500. He was happy and I was happy.
As for buying at auctions and Ebay etc I find that it is a forum where some sellers don't know and other's do. They are then expecting to make a "killing".
I have no problems in buying below market value and often "steal" as the seller is the owner with the responibility. It is for them to know more than just "hoping" to get a fortune!
a great response
My intention was not to pass judgement, merely to ask different interpretations of the situations.
I think the best answers have been ones in which people refer to Karma. In my opinion it is always a matter of conscience. YOU know if you are doing something that isnt right.
And I agree with Spanky in offering the honest price when asked. With the ability to do research so quickly via internet it is really in the seller's best interest to take that extra time. (of course - this often results in overcharging for similar looking goods)
Thanks everyone!
Do research before you sell...that's my motto
Personally, I think it's the obligation of the seller to know what they're selling before they sell it. Anytime you sell something and aren't sure of the value, you should research it. I'm more apt to pay more than the asking value with older people because many of them don't use the internet because it confuses them. But anyone who is younger, can easily do research online.
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