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Aalto 60 stools..  

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NULL NULL
(@teapotd0meyahoo-com)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 4318
18/07/2008 9:29 pm  

CC
If you paid with credit card via PayPal, you can also dispute the charge with the credit card company as an additional layer of protection.


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NULL NULL
(@paulannapaulanna-homechoice-co-uk)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 696
18/07/2008 10:04 pm  

Ok maybe not such an honest...
Ok maybe not such an honest mistake! Its really quite unlike me to think the better of someone.... I doubt you'll have any problems getting a refund - if he's got any sense the seller should will do it, if not Paypal will. I imagine Ebay are quite sensitive about fakes at the moment!!


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rockland
(@rockland)
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Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 984
18/07/2008 11:09 pm  

Classic SNAD
Hang on to the e-mails from the seller.
And don't be angry. (or just a little bit for not asking here before you bid:)
Who knows. The seller may have been fooled as well and is passing it on
and hopping the buyer doesn't notice the difference. Or just an antique
collector confused by the whole MCM gold rush.
Alvar Aalto's design is difficult to describe to a non-woodworker.
"The leg, which he dubed the "bent-knee",...He solved the problem not by bending a solid piece of wood at a ninety-degree angle but by forming a
sandwich of thin laminates that could be easily bent. The stool leg was a
solid, straight piece of birch: just below where the bend was to be it was
backsawn to make it pliable. A piece made of identical wide laminates was
then glued onto the solid leg. This end of the leg was then bent and attached
to the underside of the stool top."
(while all plywood is made from laminated wood, that is, pieces that have
been glued together. not all laminated wood is plywood. Plywood is made
from veneers, each of which is laminated with the grain facing perpendicular
to the grain of the adjacent sheet.)
Judging by some sites exclaiming "Target has Alto Aavar stools for 14.99! eurika,
and 1/10th the price!"
(spelling intentional), the difference is quite clear. It isn't even a reproduction.
It's a knock-off.
http://www.artek.fi/en/about_3.html


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rockland
(@rockland)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 984
18/07/2008 11:12 pm  

the 'sally stool' ?
How does Target get away with this?
(or, how come it isn't 9.99)
http://www.target.com/Sally-Stool/dp/B00139WGB8/sr=1-1/qid=1216400857/re...


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NULL NULL
(@teapotd0meyahoo-com)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 4318
18/07/2008 11:37 pm  

Wow.
You can find the original for less.


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rockland
(@rockland)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 984
19/07/2008 6:02 am  

nick
you do have a case and support.
i support it!. (ask away)
It is just a pain to go through it. But a worthy cause.
In the end the anger will subside.
E-bay is a risk. Homework is key. I think you know now what mistake you
made but that is not a mistake to take as a lesson. Fight it!
I just finished a dispute.
My message from e-bay this morning...
"Thank you for taking the time to report this listing for violation of
our Excessive Shipping Charges policy.
We are working hard to combat the practice of excessive shipping charges
on eBay and very much appreciate your help in identifying sellers who
you believe are charging excessively for shipping. Please continue to
report these types of listings to us. We can only clean up this problem
by working together."
It is a form letter no doubt. I've been sent it 5 times about the same issue.
But finally the strange battle ended in a poof.
After 60 days it has all vanished. E-bay erased the entire issue. (phew!)
I have also asked sellers questions for more information and have been
challenged. Or ignored.
I report misleading information only after asking the seller to
correct it. I repeatedly get e-bay support.
(i'm an itty-bitty e-bayer. 10-20 things a year.-Things that are key to the
architecture of my home. I just don't like the scammers)


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 2649
19/07/2008 7:01 am  

Other than Altek,
the only company capable of producing this kind of quality bent wood is Thonet, and the similar looking stools Thonet made were also designed by Alver Aalto.


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NULL NULL
(@paulannapaulanna-homechoice-co-uk)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 696
19/07/2008 4:05 pm  

No they weren't
No they weren't


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LuciferSum
(@lucifersum)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 1874
19/07/2008 9:37 pm  

If you follow the link below...
If you follow the link below you can find a detailed description, as well as a high-res image of the authentic stool. The image is clearly a different stool than the Ikea one you got. Email both to the seller and ebay, especially if the seller sent you to Artek's web page to begin with.
Be agressive, but polite, about the dispute. You got taken, and its a learning experience, but you should also learn how to protect yourself as well.
http://www.artek.fi/en/products.html?Id=60&P=1


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 2649
19/07/2008 10:27 pm  

No, they're weren't???
Then what are these? (they say Thonet underneath)


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LuciferSum
(@lucifersum)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 1874
19/07/2008 10:40 pm  

Gasp!
could it be that two people came up with the same radically simple design at the same time!? Never! (that was playful humor, btw - not sarcasm)
Thonet, like Plycraft, had many designs that were, shall we say, similar, to designs by other companies. It seems unlikely that Aalto would work for a company outside of the one he himself founded, especially at such a later date. The Thonet stools have plastic tops - indicating they were around much later than the wooden 60 stools of 1933.
Also, Thonet's website doesnt list Aalto amongst the designers - but they do include other famous people; Breuer & Mies amongst them.


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NULL NULL
(@paulannapaulanna-homechoice-co-uk)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 696
20/07/2008 2:47 am  

They are 4 legged stools with...
They are 4 legged stools with a passing resemblance to an earlier Aalto design....thats all!!! The only connection Aalto had with Thonet is that he entered a competition run by Thonet in the 1920s.....and didn't win (the stool was several years in the future at the time). You'll notice that the legs are plywood not solid, its proportionally wrong, the seat does not have the veneer band and the legs are tapered. Not Aalto. The only designs that are 'Aalto' but 'not Aalto' are certain designs Artek - Pascoe released to the US market in the 50s where under their own volition they 'improved' a number of his designs including funnily enough some leg tapering! Disgusted at such a liberty being taken, Aalto severed his connection with them.


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barrympls
(@barrympls)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 2649
20/07/2008 5:11 am  

Well, I got those red plastic topped
stools on eBay for not much.....knowing full well that they were Thonet.
I use 'em as occasional tables in the living room and they look nice. I also sit on them as a stool too.


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