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Another rosewood ID
 

Another rosewood ID  

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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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27/10/2021 7:06 pm  

I'll preface this by saying I don't take the time or expertise of posters here for granted, and, as such, I try to use this forum as a last resort...but these have me stumped as well. 

Beautifully made Danish chairs. Of particular note to me is what appears to be solid rosewood ply (as opposed to veneer on cheaper ply) for the backrests; correct me if I'm wrong, but the end grain visible in the photos would seem to indicate this. They bear some obvious similarities to well known designs but I have yet to find an exact match. Any leads appreciated 🙏 

1635354410-20211027_125218.jpg

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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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27/10/2021 7:10 pm  

Back rest

1635354601-20211027_125145.jpg

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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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27/10/2021 7:10 pm  

Alternate view

1635354637-20211027_125134.jpg

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leif ericson - Zephyr Renner
(@leif-ericson)
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28/10/2021 11:39 pm  

It looks to me like there is a sheet of rosewood veneer over something else that has been stained?  


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tktoo2
(@tktoo2)
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29/10/2021 3:29 pm  

Have to agree with leif in that something appears off about this chair.

It has certainly seen more than a bit of tarting-up which always sets off my alarm bells.


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Kyle Barrett
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30/10/2021 6:05 pm  

I wouldn't agree the ply between the veneer is made from rosewood. That's mostly unheard of. It'd be a waste of an expensive wood, it's fairly brittle because it's so dense and gluing oily tropical hardwoods is not as reliable as the usual ply materials. And of course, ply is dependent on being glued.

An exception I've seen are the majority of Niels Koefoed's chairs, the curved back legs are thick 0.5cm sheets of laminated rosewood. I'm sure there's other exceptions.

You can see in the photo you've posted, right at the edge of the backrests the rosewood veneer is a dark line sandwiching the lighter brown (obviously stained) wood together.

The design does remind me of those Funder Schmidt & Madsen chairs you see posted online, but the shapes are all wrong even if the overall construction is similar.

 


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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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01/11/2021 2:06 am  
 
Posted by: Kyle Barrett

I wouldn't agree the ply between the veneer is made from rosewood. That's mostly unheard of. It'd be a waste of an expensive wood, it's fairly brittle because it's so dense and gluing oily tropical hardwoods is not as reliable as the usual ply materials. And of course, ply is dependent on being glued.

An exception I've seen are the majority of Niels Koefoed's chairs, the curved back legs are thick 0.5cm sheets of laminated rosewood. I'm sure there's other exceptions.

You can see in the photo you've posted, right at the edge of the backrests the rosewood veneer is a dark line sandwiching the lighter brown (obviously stained) wood together.

The design does remind me of those Funder Schmidt & Madsen chairs you see posted online, but the shapes are all wrong even if the overall construction is similar.

 

I agree that ply rosewood makes no sense, but I'm telling ya, when you're looking in-person it's pretty hard to deny. I don't see the dark line you're referring to, but I think that is an artifact of the photo rather than an actual feature of the backrest - in person, there is a seamless transition in colour/character from the front of the backrest to the edge of the back rest (*definitely* does not look staine), and the edge grain in the ply pieces appears to me to be consistent with that of rosewood or similar woods (definitely 'tropical' looking - no way it's beech). Fwiw,  I brought it to a local high-end furniture maker for a second opinion and they concurred.

Funder Shmidt & Madsen was as close as I got as well!


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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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01/11/2021 2:08 am  
Posted by: tktoo2

Have to agree with leif in that something appears off about this chair.

It has certainly seen more than a bit of tarting-up which always sets off my alarm bells.

Can you be more specific about what you mean by 'tarting-up'? Nothing about these chairs (of which I have 4 exactly matching examples in pristine condition) appears to be after-market, if that's what you're suggesting. And, to clarify, I don't think Lief was suggesting anything was off about the chairs - he was simply observing commenting on the nature of the ply construction.


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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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01/11/2021 2:09 am  
Posted by: tktoo2

Have to agree with leif in that something appears off about this chair.

It has certainly seen more than a bit of tarting-up which always sets off my alarm bells.

Can you be more specific about what you mean by 'tarting-up'? Nothing about these chairs (of which I have 4 exactly matching examples in pristine condition) appears to be after-market, if that's what you're suggesting. And, to clarify, I don't think Lief was suggesting anything was off about the chairs - he was simply observing commenting on the nature of the ply construction.


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waxa
 waxa
(@elmo)
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01/11/2021 2:17 am  
Posted by: leif ericson - Zephyr Renner

It looks to me like there is a sheet of rosewood veneer over something else that has been stained?  

That's what I would have assumed, but the end grain on the ply layers is consistent with that of rosewood and the colour/character is identical to that of the rosewood veneer. Again, I realize this would be highly unusual/expensive/impractical, but visually it's difficult to deny, especially when compared to other examples where the veneer-on-stained-beech-ply construction is far more obvious (e.g., the set of rosewood Poul Volther dining chairs I also have at the moment - very clear difference in colour/character between the veneer and ply on the back rests). 


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leif ericson - Zephyr Renner
(@leif-ericson)
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01/11/2021 3:09 am  

Post some really sharp close up photos of the end grain and the side grain edges. Get as close as you camera can get and take a sharp photo. 


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tktoo2
(@tktoo2)
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Posts: 745
01/11/2021 2:59 pm  

@elmo,

The chair in your photos looks too fresh for a vintage piece to my eye. No evidence of wear or normal use, wrong finish, not a speck of grime or scratch or ding anywhere, newly-reupholstered, the way each leg evenly darkens toward the floor, all suggest to me that someone went to considerable, relatively recent effort to achieve this look. Of course this is simply my impression based on three small images on a screen and worth exactly what it cost. Apologies for any unintended offense.

It's an attractive chair. Reminds me of Eric Buck designs in some ways. No doubt there are vintage pieces in similar condition out there and buyers willing to pay a premium for such. I'm just not one of them.

And, again, I must agree with leif and Kyle that use of rosewood for the inner plys would be highly unusual for all the reasons they've offered. There are many tropical hardwoods that appear very similar. Correctly identifying the actual species would require microscopic analysis by an experienced wood technologist.

Best of luck.

 

 


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leif ericson - Zephyr Renner
(@leif-ericson)
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01/11/2021 3:20 pm  

@tktoo2 I doubt we will need microscopic analysis here. My expectation is that better photos will show that there is a veneer layer front and rear and stained Luaun or Ramin or maybe Beech, but one of the usual suspects. One does not need a microscope to see veneer layers over inner plies or to differentiate between a Blue Jay and an African Grey Parrot. Of course if it is indeed any sort of rosewood that would be very useful data too to identify the piece. 


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tktoo2
(@tktoo2)
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01/11/2021 4:22 pm  

@leif-ericson,

I'd also bet on one (or more) of the usual suspects for substrate lamination in this case but, on any given day in any production shop, a craftsman might use whatever material available. Maybe even one or more of the dalbergia species. I'd venture that for the purpose of identifying a vintage piece of production furniture, it hardly matters.

We could argue all day about what a certain piece looks like in a photograph online, but I've got errands to run and fallen leaves to rake...


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Kyle Barrett
(@kyle-barrett)
Illustrious Member Moderator
Joined: 2026 years ago
Posts: 667
01/11/2021 11:20 pm  

There's a fairly defined dark line there, that'd be a strange photographic artifact. I've seen such a phenomenon in other forms of media, where there is a dark outline around a form. However, that medium is called cartoons.

1635805253-thataintnoartifact.jpg

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